Razor spam filtering


#1

Has razor spam filtering been turned off? I have not seen anything in my Junk folder since 1/8, and I am seeing a lot more spam in my mailbox.

–Sam


#2

Yes, Razor is no longer used as far as I know. DreamHost installed a special version of SpamAssassin now which is a billion times better!

Go to http://webmail2.dreamhost.com and login with your full e-mail address to see the new options, and search around these forums to find earlier postings about this. There has been a lot of writings about this, and people seem to be very satisfied. If you have questions, post again!

TorbenGB
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#3

It’s great that SpamAssasin is considered “a billion times better!” Unfortunately, I can’t use it because I use a catch-all for my domain. A coworker can’t use SpamAssasin because SquirrelMail does not work for the number of folders he has.

Finally, I use IMAP. Quite frankly, I don’t want to have to log in with a different mail program in order to make sure that my mail isn’t be flagged as spam.

–Sam


#4

It doesn’t take much to compile and install spamassassin in your account. Do a google search on spamassassin and dreamhost.

Also, spamassassin.org has documentation for installing it in your user account.

This should solve your problems.
btf


#5

[quote]Yes, Razor is no longer used as far as I know.

[/quote]

Not used by whom? Used by me, at least according to the Panel! :wink: Do you mean DH have disabled it? If so I’d be interested to see the announcement. I see none on the Announcements list.

[quote]DreamHost installed a special version of SpamAssassin now which is a billion times better!

[/quote]

It might be if it could be in general used in place of Razor. It can’t.


#6

[/quote]

I stand corrected. Razor is still available like it has always been.

[quote]if it could be in general used in place of Razor. It can’t.
[/quote]

Could you elaborate on this? I find the new junk mail filter very useful.

TorbenGB
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#7

Could you elaborate on this?

[/quote]

A user of Razor cannot in general just switch to Junk Filter in its place, due to the additional restrictions of the Junk Filter e.g. incompatibility with catch-all, operating on domain rather than mailbox etc. Perhaps when Junk Filter gets integrated into the DH panel, there’ll be [] ‘Filter with Junk Filter’ next to the existing [] ‘Filter spam with Razor’, in which case it will be possible to switch directly. I think that will make it accessible to many more users.


#8

My issue with the new Junkmail isn’t even the fact that I couldn’t use a catch all (although that is annoying) it’s more the fact I have to go into a special webmail to even control it and check the junk it catches.

I use IMAP, not webmail. I don’t want to have to log into webmal, let alone a special one, to do something that’s easily done with Razor. Until they integrate it and make it less of a hassle, I won’t use it.

bryan | website


#9

These are valid points, and I’m sure DH is aware of this roadblock to the users. Or submit a suggestion about this – it would be much welcomed!

TorbenGB
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#10

Just checked mine, and find likewise Razor’s spam-catching ceased on the 7th of this month. :frowning:


#11

I’m thinking about moving to dreamhost, but anti-spam is pretty important to me.

Could you verify my understanding:

  1. Razor support is available for all accts on a per domain basis, but isn’t that effective.

  2. Spamassassin isn’t a control panel option that you just switch on like other providers do it, you have to install it yourself, but it works very well.

  3. Spamassassin only works on an account by account basis, you can’t switch it on for all accounts in the domain.

Thanks,
Mike


#12

[quote]1) Razor support is available for all accts on a per domain basis
[/quote]

On a per-mailbox basis.

[quote]but isn’t that effective.
[/quote]

For me: ~50% effective, but 0% effective since a few days ago. It seems broken.

[quote]2) Spamassassin isn’t a control panel option that you just switch on like other
providers do it, you have to install it yourself,
[/quote]

It is preinstalled as “Junk Filter” and is a control panel option, but not yet a fully integrated one - you enable on the control panel but configure it only through webmail Options.

[quote]but it works very well.
[/quote]

For me: doesn’t work at all - has caught nothing, including even blacklisted messages. But I read that it has worked for others, so I think it is just a bit sensitive to mail config. Plus this implementation has some limitations/restrictions that may or may not be a problem for you.

[quote]3) Spamassassin only works on an account by account basis, you
can’t switch it on for all accounts in the domain.
[/quote]

You can switch it on/off for each domain.


#13

Thanks for the replay. But if spamassassin is avilable from Dreamhost (even if control is in their webmail acct), why are people installing their own versions of it?

It seems that you can’t have a catch-all email address and use spam assassin at dreamhost - is that right? My current host can do both at the same time.

Also, why can’t you check the spam folder through an outlook client? Squirrelmail is just a IMAP client, if there is a junk folder there, it should be possible to see it from Outlook or another IMAP client. Am I missing something?

Thanks,
Mike


#14

[quote]why are people installing their own versions of it?
[/quote]

I’m not one of them, and hopefully one of them will be along to answer, but I guess to get full functionailty/flexibility.

[quote]It seems that you can’t have a catch-all email address and use spam assassin at dreamhost
[/quote]

You can’t have a catch-all and use DH’s SA-based Junk Filter, but I’ve seen no suggestion you can’t have a catch-all with your own SA installation.

[quote]Also, why can’t you check the spam folder through an outlook client?
[/quote]

IIUC that’s a limitation of this “first stab” at implementation. And hence this will be addressed.

[quote]it should be possible to see it from Outlook or another IMAP client. Am I missing something?
[/quote]

Not as far as I can see! I likewise can’t use JF seriously until there’s a machine mailbox interface.

For other JF snags, see http://discussion.dreamhost.com/postlist.pl?Cat=&Board=forum_troubleshooting&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=14.


#15

Weird, my current host has SA and a catch all address, and it all works together fine. And my junkfolder is visible as an IMAP folder too.

I was really liking the special deal that’s available now but I have to have spam filtering so I guess I’ll have to pass.

Thanks again though for answering my questions.

Mike


#16

Mike, you can still try out DreamHost for 91 days and see what they have to offer. They have a full money-back guarantee, so you have no risk.

About their spam filtering, here’s my view on it:

Razor is per-mailbox but it is not very effective. I stopped using it a few months back because I switched to the new SpamAssassin-based “Junk Filter” solution.

The Junk Filter is not only SpamAssassin but extra code as well. This combination works extremely well for me – I get about 0,2% junk mail now compared to earlier, and I used to get a lot.

The Junk Filter is turned on or off for a whole domain at a time (using the control panel), and can only be turned on if there is not a catch-all on the domain. Some people find this limitation bad but I don’t mind; it’s just a question of knowing your addresses and creating those that you need.

The Junk Filter settings are individual per mailbox and are controlled by logging into http://webmail2.dreamhost.com and going to Options. You can adjust a “tag” level that marks the message as spam but still puts it to your mailbox, and you can adjust a “catch” level that will put the message in a special quarantine folder. Getting these values right is not hard, and will help you to optimize your junk level according to what you actually receive.

The custom own-domain webmail does not show this Quarantine folder because the quarantine is actually on a separate mailserver, not part of your own mailbox. That’s why you must use http://webmail2.dreamhost.com specifically to check and change your Junk Filter, but for all other mail tasks you can use your own-domain webmail or any mail client software.

I am extremely happy with DreamHost in general and also with the new Junk Filter. I suggest that you try it out and if you’re not happy after 89 days you can always get your money back!

TorbenGB
Try out DreamHost with a free WebIDPrices, options


#17

I installed spamassassin on my own. My answer? 'Simply flexibility. I don’t get much spam to begin with, but liked being able to tweak control myself. Specifically I liked BAYES ability, which dreamhost’s master server doesn’t support. I also get some level of African inheritance spam that makes it past the default DH spam setup. It gets caught with BAYES, so thats my reason.

DH’s spamassin works great for most people. Why DH doesn’t allow catch-alls, is because there are some spammers that will spam an insane number of userid’s, per domain. If you have catch-alls, this would quickly overwhelm their master spam checking server.

Or so the story goes.
btf


#18

Torben, thanks for your note. Unfortunately to tell how much spam I’m going to get at DH I have to move my domain over to it so all my email comes in at DH, and that’s quite a lot of efffort only to have to move it back.

As I said, I was hoping to move to DH because of all the good things people say about it and the value it provides, but spam filtering is important to me.

I have never heard of a host storing spam in a folder on a seperate server - why in the world would you do this? If it’s in my mail mailbox folders then it would take up my disk pace and encourage me to clean it up and not let it build up, as well as to avoid doing things that cause spam in the first place.

This seems to be a much bigger factor than not supporting a catch all address with SA enabled. My current host supports this, as do all the other hosts I’ve looked at, so I don’t understand why DH should feel so concerned about it. Did they support it at one point and then get burned badly?

Support folks also told me that DH is planning on moving to SA 3.0 soon. Will any of these policies change at that point?

The catch-all is something that’s annoying to live without, but not being able to look at junk folders via outlook would be a problem for my users - half never need any webmail anyway.

Thanks,
Mike


#19

Hi Mike,
my comments were about the DreamHost-hosted junkmail filter. You could also, like bfaber wrote, install SpamAssassin yourself and be in total control AND keep your catch-all. I’ve also heard extremely good things about DSpam.

Anyhow, I hope you find a solution that works for you, on a host you are happy with.

TorbenGB
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